Interesting article that exposes a lot of things. I must yet disagree with the conclusions that author of this post came to. I hope to write more about it later. Also I want to encourage you to read the comments that people wrote on his post….
Not long ago TV counselor Dr. Phil asked a question via Twitter which was quickly deleted:
When I first saw it I didn’t get the impression that he was implying it was OK to have sex with drunk girls (or that he was asking “for a friend”). I had figured he was trying to gauge public opinion for a future show. There are enough men out there, most likely on college campuses, who wouldn’t think it unethical to have sex with a girl who was drunk. So in this regard his question has merit.
More than this, I also think there is a tendency to overlook that the majority of men who would have sex with a girl who is drunk is probably drunk himself. This facet rarely makes its way into the discussion. All to often when both the guy and the girl are at a party drinking it…
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August 29th, 2013 at 12:00 am
Thanks again for the reblog! I’m curious though what part of my conclusion you disagree with. I am not excusing a situation where a man does coerce or force himself upon a woman even if he is under the influence. What I find suspect is the presumption of guilt men carry, especially if both are impaired and it is one word against another.
August 29th, 2013 at 12:12 am
Your most welcome, it was my pleasure. Unfortunately, I will keep this brief, and will try to get to it in greater detail in a post, and will send you a copy of it. In a nutshell though, I will be arguing that men have an image to bear, and that it is different than a woman’s. It is a principle, I believe, that reflects Scripture. I agree with you, men have been vilified and are always the one’s being blamed, at least, with things like sex. The military officially has a guilty until proven innocent policy, that made my blood boil. I found out about men whom went to jail and their lives ruined because a woman lied about what happened. Oh no, I most certainly understand with regards to the double standard/everyone being quick to hang men out to dry.
I agree with you that there is a double standard, and I agree that there is a degree of unfairness. And I agree that holding the man guilty and not her is total crap, 9 times out of 10 they are both drunk and both willing. You are absolutely correct, that it is often times guilt. With that being said, I believe that it is more wrong for a man to hit a woman, and that it is more wrong for a woman to lose her virginity. It is still wrong on BOTH accounts. But I believe that because a woman is to uphold beauty, and innocence is so closely connected, it is, at least in a sense, worse for her to lose it. And because man has been given the gift of strength, and not women, it is all the more wrong when we abuse and pervert a gift. A double standard yes, but I think that in the end it equals out, and is the way God intended it. Of course, not the way the feminists have made…our sin makes things bad, and all sin is a distortion of the image we are to bare, but the images that men and women are to bare are different, and I think that that impacts the whole argument. Does what I say make sense or have I only made things more confusing? I hope this is something you would like to dig into, as iron sharpens iron.
August 29th, 2013 at 12:16 am
I wholly agree with you when we’re factoring in our Christian worldview filter. My post was an offering to the general reader and culture as a whole.
I also believe men have a much greater responsibility to protect women and protect their integrity as women.
Great thoughts on this.
August 29th, 2013 at 1:22 am
Outstanding! I am glad we are in agreement. Would love to dig deeper; I am trying to write a book on this whole subject. So your input and help will be greatly appreciated.
September 7th, 2013 at 11:28 pm
You did not stay on topic in your article and you did not show that you understand what abuse is and its very real gender specific issues.
September 8th, 2013 at 12:28 am
Abuse is never a gender specific issue, such a view is incredibly and intolerantly narrow and exclusive. Your information is incorrect, as well, for if we were to assign a ‘gender’ to this issue, it would a problem for the men, as most violence that is done by men, is done towards other men.
Men are 3.4 times more likely to be murdered in a study from 2002. Men were almost 40% more likely to be the victim of a violent crime in 2003.
According to the 2002 survey that I have posted below, both men and women are MOST likely to attack…MEN. Do your research and do not believe the media or the lies that you have been fed.
U. S. Department of Justice
Click to access htus02.pdf
September 8th, 2013 at 12:41 am
September 23rd, 2013 at 4:35 am
The double standard you so deplore has long been applied to women here and abroad. There have been thousands of years of persecution of women for stuff men did without any kind of punishment while women paid with their lives or mutilation. If the pendulum has swung a bit to the other side and I’m not convinced it has, well, turn about fair play. I didn’t notice you guys up in arms as women have been presumed to deserve being raped. Or shunned or stoned or hanged or burned at the stake or whatever other hideous punishments have been handed out to women for sinning. I would suggest to all you tough guys,– strap on a pair and man up. Stop whining. At least no one is stoning you to death.
September 23rd, 2013 at 4:41 am
If you want to grind an axe, I recommend you find a tree. Your hatred of men will do you no good here.
September 26th, 2013 at 3:40 pm
Good morning. Thank you for noticing my site.
I am quite fascinated with what I am reading thus far. I wonder if you would throw an axe my way, if I ventured to share actual experiences with you, as I have seen both sides of this argument?
I must say that I AGREE with a great deal of your argument FOR men, because I was a step-mommy for twelve of the fourteen years my husband and I were together. We had a harrowing life, because his ex used the children of their marriage as pawns, and taught them to destroy our marriage, while also doing things to her own son, and turning a blind eye to what her boyfriend was doing to her own children, but that is for another blog.
In the almost three years that I have been thrown into the dating scene, what I have found to be the case for probably 60% (or more) of single men my age, (40ish) is that they are homeless. Now, some may be living in a hotel, with their parents, or other family member, but really, its a homelessness. Many of these men are really GOOD men that were thrown away, because, for a roughly twenty year period they worked themselves to death for a material based woman who pushed him into pleasing her with ‘things’, making herself a golden calf. When she tired of bullying him and threatening to take his kids away, ruin him, do this and that if he didn’t do ‘x’, then she found a new man and took the worn out to court, leaving her with his i.e. -farm, new built home, lovely older paid for home, etc. as well as a hefty monthly bill. She gets to keep her hair appointments, nice car, pedicures, lap dogs, etc.etc. he is lucky to have $100. a week in total, for himself.
Note, I am not saying PERFECT, I am saying ‘real’. When I meet them, they are falling all over me because they get so excited that a woman finds value in them that they just want to move right in, because it’s a chance to PROVIDE for someone again. There are many, many problems at this point – as many are now addicts, covered in physical pain for their labors, covered in toxic shame, loss of authentic self wounds never healed from childhood, etc. Women have been trained and encouraged from a cruel, Creatorless society to do this, as the downfall of our civilization stems from the corrosion of the family nucleus, for when two become one, they are unstoppable. It is much easier to control a society where a single parent depends on hand outs from a government with strict guidelines on how that money is to be doled out, (put Johny on this medicine, make Johny take this blood test, that test, go here, go there, buy only this food, that food, or we wil take both him and you sustenance away). When we are torn apart, we are desperate, and willing to do what it takes to both feed, and keep our kids. I know, because I am doing my best to get out of this gerbil cage.
(this should be a post, so perhaps I could be a guest writer in the future, lol)
On the other hand, rape is rape is rape, MasonDan, and you were very misinformed as to both parties being drunk, etc. Rape happens everywhere. A great deal of rape is actually incestuous in nature, where a father, grandfather, mother’s boyfriend, brother cousin, etc is involved. (And yes, women do rape males, as well.) And, these same people are also doing it to other MALES in their own family. Other times it was someone the victim knew, like a family or childhood male friend. I have experienced this in my practice for the past two decades. The reason women wish to grind axes with you is that you are a male, who apparently, as never been raped. It hurts a woman, such as myself, who has been raped, on more than one occasion, and molested when a small child who had no choice about her virginity, to hear your harsh words. My oldest step son molested, sodomized, raped both my special needs’ sons, and yes, like you mention above, men do violence against each other, and women should not just allow every man they meet into their homes around small children, nor should they lie down with same man just because there’s an opportunity.
I have read the bible 3 times, completely, was on a bible quiz team, and have a great love for the works of Christ.
I speak to the Holy Spirit daily in my six hours of work, research, meditation and prayer for my clients, wishing to give them the best, objective information for self-healing that I possibly can.
It would be helpful, and most enlightening for your research, if you would perhaps consider polling people, being open and caring to all, and asking them to share their stories with you. Do actual first hand research with men and women and let them tell you their stories. Not only will this change your heart, but it will give you new ways to see how to truly spread Christ’s love to ALL who need it, instead of further alienating yourself from the truth. Which is what we all know, will set us free.
If you would like to know more about what I have learned in my practice or life, I would be glad to share it with you.
Blessings, Rochelle, Atsila Agisdii, Fire Eater
September 27th, 2013 at 12:06 am
Thank you for taking the time to both read my blog and also for taking the time to reply. I do truly appreciate it. I don’t have too terribly much to say in reply. I DO actually intend to do some polling, I plan on using my blog as a means of research and editing for some books that I would like to write. Your idea is a wonderful one, thank you.
In regards to your comment about rape. I do not think that anywhere I was justifying rape. I am however, saying that, from MY experience, I have seen a lot of women get drunk, have sex, and then regret it the next day. In the military with a lot of high school and college age women, this is a common thing. I am not saying that rape does not happen or that its acceptable.
I can in fact tell you about a women who was in the military; caught have a threesome, and so said she was raped. Later when she came forth, ADMITTED that she lied…it didn’t matter. The military had to press charges. They went to prison. Careers and lives are destroyed. This type of stuff is not mentioned, this is the ‘other’ side of the story, the one that people don’t want told.
I hope that helps to give a better understanding of what I was trying to say. I wish you well and best regards in your blogging journey!
September 26th, 2013 at 11:21 pm
Why did you do that? Why did you tear this man apart? He is expressing his view of a problem he sees in the world and you have nullified it, told him he’s wrong. Yes, woman do have to deal with abuse and it is frightening, but men do too, and I can imagine the fear would be no less. Woman do lie, it is a fact. However, I don’t believe masondan was condoning rape, whether he has been raped or not – you made an assumption about him there. You would only know whether he has been raped or not if you asked him.
I will also comment on your statement about men being homeless because they live in a hotel or with their parents. Who said you have to buy or rent a house and live in it? They can live in a caravan if they like and be happy, it doesn’t make them any less of a man for doing it, and being satisfied with it. I don’t think you should date these men because you want to improve them or help them. Let them be the men they are, and if you don’t like the way they are, don’t date them.
If I received a post like yours on my blog, I would probably cry.
October 5th, 2013 at 1:32 am
This is a great debate you have going on here. I feel that you have been wrongly attacked for your views here. It appears that your words may have been misunderstood, possibly due to the emotional turmoil and difficult experiences of your readers. In which case, would be very understandable. With that said, I commend you for keeping your thoughts together and not becoming heated over the issue at hand.
I do believe that there are double standards all around us that occur quite frequently. Rape and assault are definitely the top two that one would consider. However, double standards leak into many areas of society and the world as a whole.
A crime, regardless of who commits it, is wrong and a person should be held accountable and justice should be served. A man should not be held guilty solely based on the fact that he is a man. Men have earned a bad reputation, yes, but that doesn’t mean that every accused man is guilty. There are many innocent men out there who have been made the target of women who are seeking revenge. Likewise, a woman shouldn’t be viewed as innocent merely because she paints a pretty image on the outside or is a smooth talker. Evil abounds in both genders.
Also, thanks for reading my blog and for being my 200th follower! That made my day!
October 5th, 2013 at 1:36 am
It was my pleasure! Though I had no idea of course. Thank you for check out my site and taking the time to comment. Your support is greatly appreciated, I truly need it, you are a blessing. Thank you again, and I am looking forward to more of your comments.
October 5th, 2013 at 1:45 am
You’re welcome. I look forward to reading more of your posts.